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Post by storeboughtcake on Jul 6, 2009 19:54:01 GMT 1
I am more of a scientific thinker so I believe in the Evolution Theory. It is very true that Evolution does not fully explain our presence on Earth but neither does the belief that a Divine Creator (who we aren't sure even exists and have no records to verify he exists) just simply "made" all of us. Sure, religion helps a lot of people get through tough situations but it also creates difficult problems. Another thing, I don't understand how so many diverse religions have a different view on how life is supposed to be and how they are all so sure that they are solely right. If you think about it, back in the Middle Ages Priests would make the people pay their way to a good afterlife with indulgences. It could very well be that religion was simply a way to gain power and money, as said before.
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Post by newboy on Jul 7, 2009 10:05:18 GMT 1
^ But evolution says that humans and monkeys share a common ancestor, that isjust extremely hard to believe. Humans are so much more complex than monkeys, we move in different ways, we show more emotion, we have a different shape and size, we talk, and so on. I know evolution states that these features must have progressively developed over time, but if that was true surely there would be some sort of middle ground, where there is an animal someway in between a human and a monkey, sharing both features, that is why i think evolution cannot be true.
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Post by Rogue on Jul 7, 2009 14:56:12 GMT 1
Also, if evolution is true, why can we still find monkeys on planet Earth...? Some of them live with humans, and close to humans... How would you answer that...? I'm just wondering... I was always confused about that one question...
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Post by newboy on Jul 7, 2009 19:41:22 GMT 1
^ Im not sure but it might be to do with the idea of survival of the fittest, where things adapt to have a better chance of living, and producing offspring.
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Post by storeboughtcake on Jul 7, 2009 19:53:34 GMT 1
You both have very good arguments against evolution and quite frankly, I have no idea how to counterattack them. haha. I'm actually doubting Evolution now myself. I have a question though: If you do not believe in God's creation of the world nor Evolution...what can you believe in?
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Post by newboy on Jul 7, 2009 19:56:12 GMT 1
^ I have absolutely no idea what i believe in, and i dont really care to be honest. Im such a perfectionist that if i see the slightest flaw in something i turn against it, so i have spent a lot of time looking for flaws in both religion and evolution, and there is nothing left for me to believe in, except perhaps that we are here by chance.
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s h a d o w.
Junior Member
Befriend the shadows like I have!
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Post by s h a d o w. on Jul 8, 2009 2:11:31 GMT 1
I do beleive in god, yes... but in what way can we tell for sure if god is real or not, I beleive in evalotion to, maybe he just gave us a bust in life before letting us go on in our own ways.
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Post by newboy on Jul 8, 2009 12:55:53 GMT 1
^ We cant be sure of God's existance, unless someone dies and comes back to tell use he exists, since no one can definitively prove that has occured, we cannot prove God exists, likewise, we cannot prove that he does not exist.
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s h a d o w.
Junior Member
Befriend the shadows like I have!
Posts: 93
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Post by s h a d o w. on Jul 9, 2009 2:31:48 GMT 1
^ my point, how do we know if a person just made up the bibble there is no person who is as old as the bibble that is still living today
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Post by Titanis on Jul 9, 2009 6:09:15 GMT 1
Yikes! Such a misunderstanding of the SCIENTIFIC theory (fact) of evolution...
First off, evolution does not attempt to explain how life originated on Earth. Only how we got to the diversity of life that we see around us today. For that, there are two other theories which I'll explain briefly. The first is abiogenesis. This suggests that somewhere on Earth there was a transition from organic chemistry to biology: aka life. This is a viable idea, considering that the Earth resides in the Sun's habitable zone and that we have detected the presence of organic chemicals on other planets in the solar system (i.e. the methane/ethane lakes of Titan, the presence of methane on Mars). The other suggests that life originated on another planet, such as Mars. Some sort of impact on that planet kicked up lots of rocks, containing microbes within. These rocks went into orbit around the sun in such a manner that they eventually crash landed on Earth. The microbes they carried survived, and since Earth was so hospitable, they flourished and diversified.
All of the primates, including humans are very similar. Genetic evidence clearly shows the evolutionary relationship. Humans are more closely related to primates then any other type of organisms on a genetic level. Humans, like all other primates are omnivorous, meaning that we eat meat, plants, insects, etc. We all have a highly developed brain and sense of vision. Our dental formula (except for that of New World Monkeys; 2:1:3:2) is the same: 2:1:2:3 (meaning two incisors, 1 canine, 2 premolars, and 3 molars). We all have 5 digits on each hand and foot, with a thumb sufficiently detached from the other fingers giving us the ability to grasp objects and manipulate the environment. And when it comes to humans and apes, there are even more similarities. Humans and apes both lack external tails. We have virtually the same arrangement of internal organs and bones. We share blood types and get many of the same diseases. And our social structures and interests are much the same.
To say that humans and monkeys shared a common ancestor doesn't mean that humans evolved from monkeys. Modern humans evolved from hominids, who themselves shared a common ancestor with apes. Apes, then, shared a common ancestor with monkeys. But monkeys, apes, and hominids/humans each took separate evolutionary paths.
The process of evolution on the other hand is not a process of perfection. Instead, what works in the current environment for the time being is what will stay. Monkeys, Apes, and Humans, all being generalized (i.e. not specialized for a particular type of diet or life strategy, etc.) are all very well adapted to their environments.
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Post by newboy on Jul 9, 2009 10:23:13 GMT 1
Yikes! Such a misunderstanding of the SCIENTIFIC theory (fact) of evolution... First off, evolution does not attempt to explain how life originated on Earth. Only how we got to the diversity of life that we see around us today. For that, there are two other theories which I'll explain briefly. The first is abiogenesis. This suggests that somewhere on Earth there was a transition from organic chemistry to biology: aka life. This is a viable idea, considering that the Earth resides in the Sun's habitable zone and that we have detected the presence of organic chemicals on other planets in the solar system (i.e. the methane/ethane lakes of Titan, the presence of methane on Mars). The other suggests that life originated on another planet, such as Mars. Some sort of impact on that planet kicked up lots of rocks, containing microbes within. These rocks went into orbit around the sun in such a manner that they eventually crash landed on Earth. The microbes they carried survived, and since Earth was so hospitable, they flourished and diversified. All of the primates, including humans are very similar. Genetic evidence clearly shows the evolutionary relationship. Humans are more closely related to primates then any other type of organisms on a genetic level. Humans, like all other primates are omnivorous, meaning that we eat meat, plants, insects, etc. We all have a highly developed brain and sense of vision. Our dental formula (except for that of New World Monkeys; 2:1:3:2) is the same: 2:1:2:3 (meaning two incisors, 1 canine, 2 premolars, and 3 molars). We all have 5 digits on each hand and foot, with a thumb sufficiently detached from the other fingers giving us the ability to grasp objects and manipulate the environment. And when it comes to humans and apes, there are even more similarities. Humans and apes both lack external tails. We have virtually the same arrangement of internal organs and bones. We share blood types and get many of the same diseases. And our social structures and interests are much the same. To say that humans and monkeys shared a common ancestor doesn't mean that humans evolved from monkeys. Modern humans evolved from hominids, who themselves shared a common ancestor with apes. Apes, then, shared a common ancestor with monkeys. But monkeys, apes, and hominids/humans each took separate evolutionary paths. The process of evolution on the other hand is not a process of perfection. Instead, what works in the current environment for the time being is what will stay. Monkeys, Apes, and Humans, all being generalized (i.e. not specialized for a particular type of diet or life strategy, etc.) are all very well adapted to their environments. Ahh..thanks for clearing that up, i always took evolution to mean that we come from monkeys, lol. That makes it rather more believable in my opinion
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Post by Titanis on Jul 9, 2009 16:51:30 GMT 1
No problem. Creationists like to say we evolved from monkeys when that's just plain not true. Of course they try to make the claim that evolution doesn't happen and that men were created from dirt and that women were created from one of man's ribs. What's funnier is that they claim the fossils we find buried in the Earth are evidence of animals that died in a great flood that the benevolent God caused to punish us for sinning. But where is their evidence for this? A 200 year old book which is itself now not in its original form. The Bible has been reinterpreted and rewritten many many times.
In my opinion the only people against evolution are those who feel threatened by it (i.e. it doesn't conform exactly to their creation story), or those who just don't really understand it.
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Post by Sloane on Aug 11, 2009 23:18:44 GMT 1
this science hurts my brain
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Post by Titanis on Aug 12, 2009 0:48:01 GMT 1
That's because you don't use your brain enough. Use it more and it'll quit hurting
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Post by Sloane on Aug 12, 2009 1:09:21 GMT 1
awwwww thats hard
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